The Los Angeles-based trio discusses Edward Scissorhands, Twin Peaks, and their cohesive new EP
Zubin, nev ver, and thislandis are each known for their prolific work within the alternative hip-hop scene, but their collective project Where Love Goes 2 Die bucks stylistic conventions in favor of an experimental six-track outing. Ranging from devastating portraits of loss to brighter lyrical sentiments, the EP navigates a wide span of genres while calling upon garden avenue producer 4evr and rising pop-punk star LiL Lotus for captivating assists. And while each song dabbles in a slightly different sonic space, it’s unified under one aesthetic banner that makes Where Love Goes 2 Die a distinctly cohesive listen.
The experimentation on Where Love Goes 2 Die becomes particularly apparent when examining each artist’s background. While Zubin’s unmistakably pitched vocals first gained noteriety within the context of hip-hop and R&B, he’s since branched out to heavier territory as a member of the post-hardcore supergroup If I Die First. As for nev ver, his standout single “Eyes” is an emotional slice of melodic rap, but on tracks like “Knife In My Back,” he’s firmly situated within gritty rock territory. thislandis straddles the line between hip-hop and hyperpop entirely, producing for the likes of Drippin So Pretty and Lil Tracy while also working with glaive and midwxst as a guitar and production maestro.
Sitting in the Los Angeles studio of producer thislandis, the trio kicks back and discusses the long-term gestation of Where Love Goes 2 Die, from the benefits of in-person collaboration to finding inspiration in the surreal worlds of David Lynch, and much more.
Underground Underdogs: Zubin and nev ver, when did you guys meet? And was that in Philly?
nev ver: It was around right when you [nev ver] were about to leave, we had known each other but …
Zubin: It was probably around two and a half years ago when we started working together on shit, but yeah, ‘cause I was about to move to L.A. and then we did a collab tape really quick, in like a week or two before I was moving here, which was just over two years ago now. We just met through music and shit and mutual friends, yeah that was when we first started working together.
UU: How did you originally connect with thislandis?
Zubin: He [nev ver] had just moved to LA and we just made “Hurt.” We recorded a few songs with the intention of, “Oh, let’s do another tape together,” and then a couple weeks after that we were coming here every week. Every other song was with landis helping on production and then we still wanted to use “Hurt” really badly as a part of it, so we had him hop on production for that too, you know, be a part of the whole thing.
UU: Did you originally link up online?
thislandis: Yeah, on Twitter, after Rest In Peace [Drippin So Pretty’s album] came out, he hit me up and said he liked it. I’d been listening to his shit for a long time, like Heavy Down Pour and Misery especially so I was like, “Oh sick. Zubin!” [laughs]
Zubin: You know how the fuck the Internet is, I just figured he probably lived in Ohio or some shit. I just DM’d him and was like, “Yo, your shit’s sick.” Coldy had used some of his shit and I just wasn’t even expecting him to be like, “Oh I live 10 minutes away…” And then he [nev ver] had just moved here and it just kind of worked out, we both have home studios but it’s always more fun to go somewhere — this is way better than my house. So I introduced them and [said], “We should all keep going and working on stuff here,” but yeah that was pretty much from the Internet.
thislandis: And then I showed him that I sent him some beats like two or three years ago. [laughs]
Zubin: They were really good and I was like, “Oh.” I felt bad, I probably just didn’t open the email. [laughs]
thislandis: [Laughs] No it’s all good, some Nedarb Misery-type beats.
UU: You mentioned it’s more fun to record together in this studio. Does that help creatively when so much work is typically done online?
Zubin: It’s just more fun, even during quarantine I was so unproductive — super unproductive, and then I feel like he [nev ver] moved here in January and … it just got me excited again about creating in general, like I wasn’t making shit at all. I was doing If I Die First and I was kind of not sure what to do with my solo stuff. I like working on music with other people.
nev ver: Yeah, I just feel it’s way more productive and everybody [is able] to have input and shit. I feel like I haven’t really made any music over the Internet because of that factor, it’s just a different vibe when you’re in a room with people. Especially all three of us, we know a little bit about everything, so it’s easier to bounce ideas off and it be more collaborative and get to the best idea rather than, “Oh this your idea on top of your idea.” It’s more like, “Oh you did that, let me do this to it.” All in the moment, capture a vibe just makes those songs feel a lot better.
Zubin: Yeah, I love randomly hearing a beat and then I can literally write a banger to it in 15 seconds or 15 minutes, but I prefer landis playing his guitar, maybe I have some keys … I don’t know, we’re all songwriters and beatmakers and it was cool … I prefer working on shit collectively rather than just opening an email … There’s nothing wrong with that either, I also really enjoy that, it’s a different type of exercise.
thislandis: Plus sometimes working on email or the Internet, you send 10 things and then they sort of like one thing and are like, “Oh, can you change this?” When in person you can just get quicker to, “Oh you like this, you don’t like this,” You can just make something faster by having real-time feedback, so that’s also appreciated. But it’s so much more fun, sometimes it feels like work by yourself, trying to envision if they like this or not.
UU: How did “Hurt” originally come to fruition?
Zubin: I think we were talking about us doing another tape … It’s cool just making beats with him [nev ver] … so “Hurt” was very much, like, I literally played a piano … and then he immediately put drums on it and then we just made the song really quickly.
nev ver: It was really quick, we made it definitely within like 30 minutes to an hour or something.
Zubin: It just happened, then landis ended up adding production probably like three, four, five months later, but we already had other songs done for the project. “Hurt” probably is a little bit weirder of a vibe than the rest of the tape maybe, but it still fits.
UU: You were explaining that the concept of the music video contrasts the darkness of the song with a different visual aesthetic. Can you talk about those visuals?
nev ver: Yeah, well he had brought up the idea of us being outside dressed in all black and how cool that would look because obviouslyit’s sunny here every fucking day … and it’s really hot, so it’d be really weird if we’re just full makeup-ed out with our homies walking the streets and how aesthetically cool it would look.
Zubin: Are you familiar with Alhambra the neighborhood?
UU: Yeah, totally.
Zubin: nev lives over there and it’s just beautiful, it’s all single homes and really visually pleasing. And you know like in Edward Scissorhands how the contrast of what Edward Scissorhands looks like to how beautiful where he lives is? That was kind of the inspiration, we were like, “Oh let’s dress weird and get everybody to dress up with crazy makeup and freakshow vibes.” And we’re just chilling in a really beautiful area in the middle of — instead of filming at night or something [to] have a dark aesthetic to it — we were all wearing makeup and landis was wearing a trenchcoat [laughs] and it was sick though, it came out really cool and exactly how I was hoping it would.
UU: With “Hurt” being the first track recorded, did it inform your approach to the rest of the EP?
Zubin: They’re all pretty different, so I don’t think “Hurt” influenced the rest of the tape in my opinion. I think the first song we did vocals for here … me and landis went to get food and he was like, “Oh, I’m gonna stay here and lay this idea down,” and I feel like that was “Eyes 2 Kill” … which is a way different vibe than “Hurt,” you know? So I don’t think it influenced the EP, it was just us making whatever the vibe was at the time.
nev ver: Even “Where Love Goes 2 Die” we had did, that was early on, one of the first things we had did.
Zubin: Yeah, I wasn’t even here for that.
nev ver: Yeah, we just made it and showed it to him and he was like, “This is fucking one of the sickest songs, let me hop on it,” and I was like, “Oh yeah, we could it use that for a tape…” I think the only song that was not kind of written together beat-wise is “Wait 4 Me” which he [landis] just had it …
Zubin: The beat was already done, but even you added …
nev ver: Yeah, we fucked with it still, it wasn’t the original.
Zubin: landis and 4evr had collabed and then we just heard it and were like, “Yeah, let’s get on this too.” It fit in its own weird way.
nev ver: It was very organic, the way I feel like the EP was made … every song has its own staple to it of what we can do, showcases a lot of our strengths, rather than, “landis cook up a beat, okay we’ll just hop on it.” Just a lot of cool songwriting.
thislandis: Yeah, different styles, different genres, every song is a different genre a little bit. There’s consistency with their vocal styles and the kind of harmonies and chords are kind of like all in a similar world even though they’re kind of like different sorts of beats or genres.
UU: I was going to bring up that it all feels aesthetically tied together, even “Where Loves Go 2 Die” which is obviously more of a pure rock direction.
thislandis: Yeah, we kept thinking of Twin Peaks, the hotel or whenever they go up there to the stage in the Roadhouse … He was like, “I want to make some shit like that!”
Zubin: It’s a great mood to be in. I love all of the music in that show.
thislandis: That’s kind of why the last song is “Silencio,” sort of like a nod to David Lynch. We were sitting there making “Where Love Goes 2 Die” and he was doing this outro that sounded really sick, just fucking with the guitars that we had recorded and pianos or whatever, just like reversing shit and we were getting surreal. I was like, “Man, this sounds like it should be its own outro song,” or whatever and we had to come up with a name for it.
UU: What sticks out to you about Twin Peaks and its soundtrack?
nev ver: Everything. [laughs]
Zubin: Angelo Badalamenti, he’s so good at composing and David Lynch has amazing music, too. A lot of the times they would go to the Roadhouse, the performer was Julee Cruise, I love her. All I really know of her music is with Angelo Badalamenti and David Lynch producing it, but that album is insane. She sings over the Twin Peaks theme song on that album, it’s so good. The vibe is just crazy, there’s nothing like that, there’s nothing like Twin Peaks.
thislandis: Actually, one of the first songs I learned on the piano was “Laura’s Theme.” I figured out myself from listening to the show, but actually one of the songs we didn’t put on the tape — it sounds like Twin Peaks, like the same chord progression — [nev ver] did some piano shit and I fucked with it andI half-timed it or slowed it down and it was like the fake nylon string guitar shit. I should dig that up. But yeah, Angelo Badalamenti takes you to this other world, you know?
UU: landis, you mentioned that “Wait 4 Me” was a beat collaboration between you and 4evr before the project began to come together?
thislandis: Yeah, I sent him a bunch of synth loops a long time ago and I loved his shit too for a while, he’s so sick. I’d been listening to his stuff like with Shinigami, so yeah I was psyched that we did some shit together. Long before they heard it, I would blast it in the car and was like, “Oh, this is so sick [laughs],” just listening to the instrumental.
UU: I’m assuming LiL Lotus came into the project organically as well?
Zubin: Yeah, [nev ver] recorded his part of “Eyes 2 Kill” and then I recorded mine here and then we left it open. I don’t know, not to rush it, just to write to it, because it was already sounding really fire. And then me and nev were chilling at Nedarb’s house with Lotus too and we were just like, “Oh, let’s make music,” and then Lotus was like, “Oh I don’t want to make something from scratch, I kind of just want to work on something that’s already a thing,” and we’re like, “Oh, I think you would fuck with this.” He wrote his shit in five seconds because he’s a genius … Yeah, he killed it.
UU: Zubin and nev ver obviously have a longstanding creative flow together, so landis, I’m curious how you learned to play to their strengths?
thislandis: It’s obvious that they’re both really good at songwriting, so we would just trade off duties, I would make a beat, nev would make a beat, we would edit what each other had done until we made the best thing possible. We had conversations about that, you know, it’s not about showing off all the things one individual can do, but making the best work possible with whatever they’re the best at. Same thing with mixing, when we were mixing it, which is so boring. [laughs]
Zubin: Unfortunately I’m awful at that, so nev had to do a lot of it … especially vocals though, nev is amazing at. It’s good to learn and watch, but it’s literally just sitting here for seven hours.
nev ver: Yeah, I felt really bad doing it. To me, mixing is fun by myself, but doing it with other people is definitely a little more straining because you can feel the vibes of everybody being over it [laughs]. It was a great learning experience … Zubin kind of being the person who isn’t involved but is away from it so you get that perspective, too. Even though it was grueling, it was still nice to have all those different ears around.
Zubin: I remember during “Out Of My Mind,” whatever way they were mixing this one part sounded like there was a saxophone in the song and I was losing my mind [laughs]. I’m like, “Can no one hear that?” But eventually it got changed enough to where I can’t hear it anymore, I’m not even tripping.
UU: Finally, how did Zubin and nev ver approach writing lyrics together on the EP? Did you tease out a narrative or was it more of an individualized process? For example, the hook on “Hurt” is super vulnerable.
Zubin: On “Wait 4 Me,” I loved the beat but I didn’t immediately have a melody or lyrics and nev was like, “Oh I have something.” While I’m listening to it, he’ll send me what he wrote to it and I’ll just go off that or vice versa.
nev ver: Yeah, I feel like we lyrically talk about very similar things so it’s not really pressure on shit. We feed off each other super easy.
Zubin: I don’t know, I feel like writing lyrics is hard [laughs], I think it’s really hard, but for me the least forced lyrics are the ones that end up sticking. But yeah, I don’t know, I think that’s the cool thing about the tape. It starts off very — vulnerable is a good word for it — but then when we wrote “Out Of My Mind,” that beat is so happy and almost gets hyperpop-ish, and I was like, “I want to be upbeat with this one.” It’s not straight up as gloomy or dark as the other ones … That hook/chorus is really poppy and catchy.
thislandis: Early on when we started working on it, we were just going for a walk, getting some food and talking about music and they were talking about The Smiths and The Cure.
Zubin: And then there’s also always inspiration. I’ll read books for that, so remember lines that you read in a book and be like, “Oh I could say that myself.” Like the “Wait 4 Me” song, when I come in, my first lyric in that song is a Get Up Kids lyric that I happened to listen that song that morning. It’s like, “Oh I’m going to use that lyric,” which is funny because it’s not a pop-punk type song, but it works, though. It can work for anything, you know?
Pre-save Where Love Goes 2 Die here and stream “Hurt” below.